How do I convert an AG recipe to an extract?

[5kbrewman]

Rhinegeist's Andromeda is a darn good beer and only available during the winter time. A couple of years ago the recipe was posted online. Here it is:
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Here is a 6 gallon recipe for you. This is the commercial recipe adapted to homebrew scale. Assuming 72% efficiency, boiloff rate of 10%:

10.75# Rahr Pale Ale malt 12 oz of Rahr White Wheat Malt 6 oz of Weyermann Vienna malt

Mash at 152 degrees F, vorlauf, lauter and sparge to yield ~6.8 gallons of wort at ~1.045

Boil for 75 minutes.

Hop additions are:

2 oz of Galaxy at 14.2% AA 20 min from end of boil (38 IBU) 3 oz of Galaxy at 14.2% AA at flame out (~10 IBU)

Fining agent of your choice when you normally add it

Let flameout hops steep for 30 minutes before cooling (simulated whirlpool hops). We get a large amount of utilization in our whirlpool, and this recipe is written assuming you will get ~10 IBUs from the flameout addition. If you choose to cool immediately after adding these hops, you'll need to add another 10 IBUs somewhere else.

Post boil vol ~6 gal at 1.051 OG

Pitch WLP090 and ferment at 68 degrees F for 7-8 days. Final gravity should be 1.008-1.009. Dry hop with 3 oz of Galaxy hops for 5-7 days.
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I have only been brewing for a year and am far from ready (if ever) to take the AG plunge. I want to scale this recipe to 2.5 gallons and use extract. How do I calculate from AG to extract? I know I'm likely demonstrating several degrees of ignorance here (vorlauf? lauter? sparge? good grief!) but any help would be greatly appreciated.

[swenocha]

There are Vienna and wheat malt extracts (both LME and DME) as well as pale malt extracts. Others may weigh in, but if it were me, for the 2.5 gallons based on the 6 gallon recipe above, I'd convert the pale to either 3.375lb LME or 2.7 lb DME. I'd convert the wheat to .25lb LME or .2lb DME, and the Vienna to .125lb LME or .1lb DME. That's a rough number based on 42% scaling down and 75% conversion to LME or 60% conversion to DME and then rounding the result. I'd likely leave the hop schedule, yeast, ferm schedule similar. I'd likely add all all malt extracts but 1/2 of the pale, bring to boil, shorten the boil to maybe 30 minutes, and I'd think about adding the other 1/2 of the pale in the last 5 min.

[BlackDuck]

I'll just leave Swen's comments alone for the conversion. I love that beer also, in fact, I love damn near everything Rhinegeist makes. I know you mention that the recipe is a few years old. It's no longer a single hopped beer with Galaxy. They now add Motueka to it. And they no longer use Vienna malt in it either. So if you brew that recipe, it will be a little different than the current version, still good, just different.

[The_Professor]

Keep in mind that malt extracts are often not 100% of anything other than barley.
A quick look shows Briess Wheat DME is 65% wheat and 35% barley while Muntons wheat DME is 55% wheat and 45% barley.
MoreBeer has Vienna DME that is 100% Vienna.

.......I have only been brewing for a year and am far from ready (if ever) to take the AG plunge. I want to scale this recipe to 2.5 gallons and use extract. How do I calculate from AG to extract? I know I'm likely demonstrating several degrees of ignorance here (vorlauf? lauter? sparge? good grief!) but any help would be greatly appreciated.

Grasshopper when you can grasp these German brewing terms you can think about doing all grain.
It's funny how a few unknown terms can halt understanding all grain brewing.
Mash: The starch in grain is converted into sugar at certain temperatures. In this recipe the grain is held for an hour at 152 degrees (in heated water). Letting the grain rest at a specific temperature is mashing.
Vorlauf: At first the liquid from the mash can be cloudy. Vorlauf is to run some of the liquid out until it is clear (returning the liquid to the top of the mash).
Sparge: A usual method of mashing uses less than the full needed water to mash the grain. Sparging is adding more hot water to the top of the mash.
Lauter: Again, a usual method uses a special container for mashing that has a "false bottom". When the mash time is done the liquid is slowly drained off. Adding the sparge water and slowly draining the liquid is lautering.

Now, of course, you may not immediately decide to spend more time and money to start brewing all grain, but there is something you can do with this brew.

Purchase a small amount of Wheat and Vienna malt. On your stove top heat some water and hold the grain at 150-155 for an hour. Drain the liquid off and add it to your all barley extract.
That would be what is called a partial mash. You take advantage of what some particular grains can bring to your extract beer.
If that interests you I am sure suggestions can be made for the correct volumes in this thread.

[The_Professor]

Just fooling with the numbers it looks like maybe 5 oz wheat malt (milled/crushed), 3 oz Vienna malt (milled/crushed), hold between 150-155 for 60 minutes with 2 quarts water.
I see 3.3 lbs Briess Pale Ale LME. You need about 3.1 so just don't get aggressive about cleaning the can.
After draining the liquid off the mini mash and depending on the size of your boil pot, use less than 2 lbs LME per gallon of water (plus the mini mash liquid (wort)) for the boil. Add the rest of the LME at the end of the boil.
The hop additions will depend on the AA of the hops you get.
A percent calculation suggests buying 4 oz hops and go from there.
I think I'd consider a 45 (or 30) min boil since the first hop addition is at 20 min.

[mashani]

And if you do not want to go with any grains like Professor suggested, I'd bump the wheat DME up to around 1.25# and reduce the pale extract accordingly (or something along those lines). Because that will get you closer to the right amount of actual wheat.

The MoreBeer Vienna DME is actually good stuff, I have used it.

But doing the little bit of grain like Professor suggested is easy enough and it's such a small amount you can crush it with a rolling pin if you need to, and I'd go that route if you can, it will make better beer.

[swenocha]

I agree with the prior three posts. If you want to do all extract, follow my post with Prof's adjustments. Or if you want to try a mini-mash, it's a great way to test the waters on all-grain with limited risk.

[Dawg LB Steve]

Here is a link to a conversion from Grain to dry and liquid equivalents. This should help in converting recipes from grain to extract and extract to grain if need be.

https://www.jaysbrewing.com/2011/11/17/ ... lme-grain/

[5kbrewman]

You guys are awesome. Thanks very much for the help and the education!