I need clarification

[Kealia]

Ron, I appreciate the link to the blog re: using gelatin, but I have some questions about it.

First, can the gelatin be used in conjunction with Whirlfloc, or should it be used in lieu of it?

It can be used in conjunction, you don't have to do one or the other.

Second, I'm a little unsure as to when it should be added. The author mentions chilling down to a very low temperature, and then adding the gelatin solution. Is this prior to pitching or during a cold crash just prior to bottling?

The latter. It's during the cold crash process. And honestly, you can either chill it first or mix it before crashing. I've done it both ways and had great results.

Third, is generic gelatin from the supermarket what he's talking about? In other words, something like Knox unflavored gelatin? I'd feel like a fool paying $2.00 for "finings" at the LHBS if I can just go up the street to Shop-Rite and get a box of the same stuff for 65 cents.

Good old-fashioned unflavored Knox. Don't buy anything expensive from your LHBS on this one.

I've only started playing with this recently myself (4 batches). I wanted to play with it on the Kolsch and it worked great so I'm just using up the rest of the packets that I bought. I've been getting good clear beers with all the other processes listed, too. I've just used this to test it out and I thought the results added even more clarity so I'm using it here and there when I feel like it.

Good luck either way!

[FedoraDave]

I'll look into it and probably give it a try on a non-competition batch later in the fall.

[Kealia]

Not to cross threads, but see my last post in my gelatin thread for my updated experiences with it.

[FedoraDave]

Interesting. Maybe gelatin would be better used as a fining for maltier beers, like Oktoberfests or English-style brown ales.

As far as other finings cutting back on aroma and flavor, I'm not so sure. I use Whirlfloc in all my AG batches, and I was noticing last night that my King Pin IPA still had strong aroma and hop-forward taste, which surprised me, because I'd have expected it to fade a little at this point. But it actually seems stronger than it did in the younger bottles.

I'm with you, though; I'm not going to sacrifice taste for appearance. If racking to a secondary for the dry hop and a cold crash doesn't do it, then them's the breaks.

[gwcr]

I've only used Irish Moss at 15 minutes left in the boil. After 6 weeks in the bottle and another 2 weeks in the fridge, they pour extremely clear. Haven't had any aroma or flavor degradation that I can tell. Just kegged my first batch about a week ago and thought about using gelatin, but want to see how just IM worked with the keg first. I'm still about 2 weeks out from a test pour, but it was an extremely clear transfer from bucket to keg (s-04 yeast). Will see how it looks in a couple weeks...

[Kealia]

Sorry, I didn't mean to imply the whirfloc or irish moss would do the same thing. That has NOT been my experience at all. I still use one or the other (depending on what the LHBS has in stock when I need it).

[oly]

I haven't read the other posts regarding gelatin, but I can add a couple more things to the discussion. My understanding is that the clear gelatin from the grocery specifies to use the entire package, and I've heard the same thing from some fellow club members. I buy gelatin at our LHBS for a very low price, and it only specifies using a teaspoon in five gallons. When I've used it, that has always worked very well for me.

As to competition submissions, remember that you can be nicked for a beer being out of style, no matter how good it is. Personally, I like a dry hopped Pilsner, as long as it's not overdone (I'd keep it to an ounce or less, and no more than a few days) but an experienced judge may fault you for it. I've had that happen to one of my submissions, and judged with a more seasoned judge who nicked a beer I liked quite a bit, for the same reason. This is particularly true for a Bo Pils. You want to be able to smell that Pilsner malt in equal measure with the hops, and the hops will stand out on their own because of the lighter malt bill.

[FedoraDave]

As to competition submissions, remember that you can be nicked for a beer being out of style, no matter how good it is. Personally, I like a dry hopped Pilsner, as long as it's not overdone (I'd keep it to an ounce or less, and no more than a few days) but an experienced judge may fault you for it. I've had that happen to one of my submissions, and judged with a more seasoned judge who nicked a beer I liked quite a bit, for the same reason. This is particularly true for a Bo Pils. You want to be able to smell that Pilsner malt in equal measure with the hops, and the hops will stand out on their own because of the lighter malt bill.

Good advice. I'll keep it in mind, and maybe check the aroma once it reaches FG and make my decision then. I wasn't intending to use more than an ounce anyway, and depending on what my nose tells me, I might use a lot less, or forego it completely.

Which reminds me, I'd like to check the gravity tonight and get an idea of when I should raise the temp on this. It's been 8 days, so I imagine it's getting close to that time.

[BlackDuck]

Can't wait to here where your gravity is. Please post. Mine was at projected final gravity at the 8 day mark and it surprised the hell out of me.

[FedoraDave]

I was getting close to 75% fermented last night, so I turned the JC up to 62 and figured I'd just let the temp rise on its own for a couple of days, stay in the low 60s for a couple of days, and then proceed from there.

[BlackDuck]

Perfect timing for your D-rest Dave...good for you!!!

[FedoraDave]

I kinda figured if I just let the temp rise gradually on its own inside the fridge, it would be better than risking shocking it by just taking the carboy out and setting it on the shelf. Besides, the basement is cooler than the rest of the house, but still too warm for an ale, let alone a D-rest.

I wish lagers didn't take so long, and weren't so fussy. Thing is, they're worth it.

[BlackDuck]

That's exactly how I did mine. I left it at 60F for 3 full days then adjusted the temp back down to 50F. So mine gradually went up in temp and gradually went back down in temp.