And you thought you'd heard everything...

[swenocha]

When I received dented cans the very first time I ordered, I got a response from Mr. B that was a considerably dumbed down version of the Muntons rep's response, FWIW.

[Wings_Fan_In_KC]

The Maillard reaction stuff is fine but:

The Chlostridium Botulinum bacteria is associated with Fish, Animals and Birds and is extremely unlikely to be found in Barley Malt Extract. Regards Graham"

Well...

1) That is a lie. It is a common soil bacteria. It becomes a type of spore when in conditions that it normally would not survive in and then re-awakens when it finds conditions it likes. The problem is that the spores are tough little buggers. The toxin can only be produced in anaerobic conditions with improperly acidified/boiled canned products. That is why any sort of pickled vegetable that is not properly acidified and boiled long enough and/or pressure canned for things that can not be acidified enough can give you botulism. Except for very young children or people with trashed immune systems, you won't get botulism simply from eating a bit of botulinum. If you eat raw honey you may have eaten spores of it. If you eat raw vegetables you've probably eaten it. It's not the botulinum that makes you sick, it's the toxins it produces in the right conditions.

2) Fish animals birds would be other types of food poisoning more likely.

3) That said - It is destroyed by the brewing/fermentation process. The toxin itself is destroyed by heat. The ph of the fermented wort and the 2%+ alcohol levels produced will take out any spores. It's more or less impossible to make beer and get botulism from it. It's also unlikely if not more or less impossible to get any other type of food poisoning from a properly fermented product that has not been compromised somehow. Which is why our ancestors fermented everything they wanted to keep. Really old school fermented pickle products (kimchee - sour kraut of the real kind - etc.) were safe even though pressure canning didn't exist because they were buried in pots in the ground and left to ferment the same way with the same types of wild bacteria and yeasts a wild beer (authentic sour beers) ferment with. Same with fermented cheeses. And fermented sausages. And anything else you can ferment.

There are not any pathogenic bacteria that survive the brewing process.

Fermentation is good.

So..............same result but different pathway. That's some good info there!

[Yankeedag]

I just got: Fish animals birds would be other types of food.. they all go good with beer.

[FrozenInTime]

I just got: Fish animals birds would be other types of food.. they all go good with beer.

Everything goes good with beer! LOL, but pizza wins hands down!! Now, ya'll go have a slice of pizza pie and a home brew! Dat's an order you peasants!