Theme and variations

[FedoraDave]

When you get a brainstorm, you're supposed to feel smart.

However, when that brainstorm comes after a major brainfart, it can make you feel kinda stupid and smart at the same time.

Here's the sitch:

I'm working on this black IPA recipe for my future son-in-law's groomsmen. So I want it to be excellent. But I don't have a firm grasp on the style. My first test batch was a little disappointing; too much bitterness from the darker malt, and not enough (or perhaps fighting with) bitterness from the hops. I just didn't feel it had the malt mellowness I wanted balanced with an aggressive hop bitterness.

I got some great responses recently, with some good suggestions on ingredients and process, and I'm going to incorporate them on the next batch.

Then I got the brainstorm. It was in BradyFumbled's response. He said, essentially, that he took an IPA recipe and just made it a little darker with some specialty grain additions. At least, that's how I read it, and then I realized that I've got a couple of good IPA recipes in the stable already, and why shouldn't I just take one of those and modify it to make it dark? Start with a recipe that works and see if I can make it work a little differently.

Musicians have been doing this for centuries; take a simple piece of music, then turn it into another piece of music by employing different technical challenges to the same melody and harmonic pattern.

Rather than formulate an entirely new recipe, I can just take what I know works and build on it. That's how black IPAs were developed anyway, am I right?

I should have seen it earlier. But this is something I'm going to keep in mind for the future.

[Gymrat]

You sure get up and start thinking early. My brain isn't functioning enough to reply to this yet.

[Banjo-guy]

You had me at ' Theme and Variations " .

Makes perfect sense to me.

[Inkleg]

The Hat, hard at thinking work before the us of rest have had coffee. See what I did there.

That sounds like a great plan Dave.

[Beer-lord]

Chris and I both did version of an IPA that was simply black. You might remember my Naked Darkness. It was not my favorite black as I really do liked some chewiness and some roast in them but this was made specifically to not have any roasty-toasty notes to it. The midnight wheat really gets it dark without it tasting like chocolate or coffee and the Special B helps give it some character. I've thought about doing this again and adding but I"m not 100% sure what I would change as it did exactly what I wanted it to do.

BeerSmith 2 Recipe Printout - http://www.beersmith.com
Recipe: Naked Darkness Black IPA
Brewer: Paul
Asst Brewer:
Style: American IPA
TYPE: All Grain
Taste: (30.0)

Recipe Specifications
--------------------------
Boil Size: 8.19 gal
Post Boil Volume: 6.77 gal
Batch Size (fermenter): 5.50 gal
Bottling Volume: 5.05 gal
Estimated OG: 1.070 SG
Estimated Color: 30.4 SRM
Estimated IBU: 89.6 IBUs
Brewhouse Efficiency: 76.00 %
Est Mash Efficiency: 90.0 %
Boil Time: 60 Minutes

Ingredients:
------------
Amt Name Type # %/IBU
11 lbs Pale Malt (2 Row) Bel (3.0 SRM) Grain 1 78.6 %
1 lbs Caramel/Crystal Malt -120L (120.0 SRM) Grain 2 7.1 %
1 lbs Munich Malt (9.0 SRM) Grain 3 7.1 %
8.0 oz Midnight Wheat (550.0 SRM) Grain 4 3.6 %
8.0 oz Special B Malt (180.0 SRM) Grain 5 3.6 %
1.00 oz Chinook [13.00 %] - Boil 60.0 min Hop 6 36.0 IBUs
0.50 oz Centennial [10.00 %] - Boil 20.0 min Hop 7 8.4 IBUs
0.50 oz Simcoe [13.00 %] - Boil 20.0 min Hop 8 10.9 IBUs
1.00 oz Citra [12.00 %] - Boil 15.0 min Hop 9 16.5 IBUs
0.50 oz Centennial [10.00 %] - Boil 10.0 min Hop 10 5.0 IBUs
0.50 oz Simcoe [13.00 %] - Boil 10.0 min Hop 11 6.5 IBUs
0.50 oz Centennial [10.00 %] - Boil 5.0 min Hop 12 2.8 IBUs
0.50 oz Simcoe [13.00 %] - Boil 5.0 min Hop 13 3.6 IBUs
1.0 pkg Safale American (DCL/Fermentis #US-05) Yeast 14 -
1.00 oz Centennial [10.00 %] - Dry Hop 7.0 Days Hop 15 0.0 IBUs
1.00 oz Citra [12.00 %] - Dry Hop 7.0 Days Hop 16 0.0 IBUs
0.50 oz Citra [12.00 %] - Dry Hop 7.0 Days Hop 17 0.0 IBUs


Mash Schedule: BIAB, Medium Body
Total Grain Weight: 14 lbs
----------------------------
Name Description Step Temperat Step Time
Saccharification Add 36.86 qt of water at 159.5 F 152.1 F 75 min
Mash Out Heat to 168.0 F over 7 min 168.0 F 10 min

Sparge: If steeping, remove grains, and prepare to boil wort
Notes:

[BlackDuck]

I'll second the Midnight Wheat addition to an already good IPA recipe. You'll keep the characteristics of the original recipe, but the Midnight Wheat addition will surely make it dark without changing the malt profile too much. Which is what it sounds like your after.

I think your on to it now Dave....give it a shot, I don't think you'll be disappointed.

[FedoraDave]

My LHBS doesn't carry Midnight Wheat, or I would have used it in the original attempt. I believe they substituted Debittered Black malt for it.

But the thing is, I DO want the malt profile to change somewhat with the darkening. I want some roastiness in it, so I'm going to add a little Chocolate malt and I may even include some Biscuit in a future incarnation, once I get the color and malt flavors I'm pleased with.

I am going to use Centennial and Warrior hops, which I used in the 100 Years War IPA I just polished off. I like the combination, although I'm wondering how the citrus aspect of the Warrior is going to work with the darker malts.

Still plenty of time for experimentation, but I think I'm on the right track now.

[Beer-lord]

It all sounds good to me. If it's black, I'll drink it. Come to think about it, if it's not black, I'll drink that too!

[JimH]

Dave, FWIW, I was working on a black IPA a while back (still am, just not moving real fast since I won't brew it for a while). Aside from some suggestions on Beer-Lord's Ace of Spades, which looked amazing, I was looking at focusing on the chocolate flavor. It sounds weird, but I had a Camelback IPA from Phoenix Brewing, and it features chocolate malt. It was delicious, the chocolate somehow complements the hops. I don't know if it would be good to just use chocolate malt, but probably some C120 and such to help darken it. But this might be a good way for you to tone down the malt bitterness you were describing.

[Gymrat]

Another way to tone down the black malt bitterness is to add it during the batch sparge. That way it only "steeps" for the 15 minutes or so that you soak your grains during the batch sparge.

[FedoraDave]

Good suggestions. I'll keep them in mind, but I want to keep it relatively simple this time. I think I've got a good malt bill to start with. But any alterations or additions will keep me referring to this thread.

[Brewbirds]

Dave I can't think which beer it was at the moment but we used roasted barley in one, it won't give you enough color alone but it will give you roasty notes if you don't want a lot of chocolate or coffee.

I know you don't want a complicated grain bill but you might want to look at Aromatic Malt's description it was great in our stout.