Vinnie's 10 factors to making better hoppy beers

[Beer-lord]

https://web.archive.org/web/20130725130 ... _Beers.pdf
The second one regarding crystal malt really surprised me. I'm on it!

[BlackDuck]

Really cool....thanks for posting that. I was a little surprised by the crystal malt comment too. Seems that a lot of IPA have crystal in them, I just don't know how much. And the other one that I found interesting was the one on yeast removal. Maybe transferring to a secondary before dry hopping might be something to try.
I'm going to print that out and take note of a few of those comments for the next IPA that I do.

[RickBeer]

Betty Hoppy?

Betty hops when you make the beer?

[Beer-lord]

Betty Hoppy?

Betty hops when you make the beer?

LOL, thanks I fixed it. Maybe Betty Crocker's daughter is named Betty Hoppy.

[bucknut]

And the other one that I found interesting was the one on yeast removal. Maybe transferring to a secondary before dry hopping might be something to try. I'm going to print that out and take note of a few of those comments for the next IPA that I do.

I've noticed this in the few ipa's that I've done by dry hopping in the secondary, and I just did my pte clone that way. Give it a try and I'd be interested if anyone else here on the borg has noticed to be the case when dry hopping during fermentation.

[DaYooper]

I pretty much always secondary my IPAs due to the boatload of hops I tend to use (after all, they are pretty much free for me). My latest CHAOS IPA I got a little bit ahead of myself and already had the sugar feeding ready prior to popping the top on the primary which was still going bananas, so ended up doing a tertiary on it. Will be interesting to see how the two dry hops take after two yeast purgings. Great link with lots to think about!

[mashani]

I would call this "How to make better West Coast style hoppy beers". I agree with everything it says in that case.

I do not agree that the crystal or a higher mash temp or a more malty presence is a problem if you are making more East Coast style beers and/or more English style beers. I do *not* agree that those flavors do not mix with American hops, especially those that are more spicy/earthy/resin/pine oriented. It might mess with the citrus, but not those flavors.

So that's what I have to say

But I like both West Coast and East Coast (and English) IPAs... I am not a "West Coast Weenie".

[Dawg LB Steve]

How does one go about purging a secondary ale pail with CO2? I have wondered about this and having a gallons worth of headspace, in the 6.5 gallon pail, since I do 5.5 gallon batches. I do have some fermentation going on in the secondary, considering I have about a pint and a half of trub. I go aprox. 10-12 days in the primary.

[BlackDuck]

How does one go about purging a secondary ale pail with CO2? I have wondered about this and having a gallons worth of headspace, in the 6.5 gallon pail, since I do 5.5 gallon batches. I do have some fermentation going on in the secondary, considering I have about a pint and a half of trub. I go aprox. 10-12 days in the primary.

Great question....I too would like to know!!

[Beer-lord]

I think because many people use carboys for secondary you might get by with blowing some CO2 in the bottom and forcing the air out the top much better than trying with an ale pale. Just a guess on my part though.

[DaYooper]

I think because many people use carboys for secondary you might get by with blowing some CO2 in the bottom and forcing the air out the top much better than trying with an ale pale. Just a guess on my part though.

Exactly!

However, as CO2 is heavier than O2, I do not see why you couldnt simply put a blanket over the wort to protect it. As long as the O is not in contact with the wort it should be safe. That is how some of those inert gas wine savers work - you dont necessarily fill up the entire bottle, you simply put a protective blanket over the wine.

A lot of times when I do a secondary I also dump a little sugar in to make sure the O gets purged as well. I may put in 1/8th or up to 1/4 cup so it is not like it affects the conditioning time at all.

[DaYooper]

Looks like he consolidated his list to single out the top 5:

http://www.homebrewersassociation.org/h ... e-cilurzo/

[Kealia]

Maybe transferring to a secondary before dry hopping might be something to try.

Speaking from experience using gelatin (which is similar/better than a secondary) it makes a big difference.
When I dry-hopped before adding gelatin it was almost completely stripped out after the yeast dropped out.
When I dry-hopped after the gelatin, it was much more prominent.

FWIW, I don't neccesarily equate "secondary" with "yeast removal". The yeast on the BOTTOM of the fermenter isn't affecting the hops at all. It's the yeast in suspension that they bind to and eventually drop out. So, simply transferring to a secondary gets you off the yeast cake but does nothing to drop yeast out of suspension. Now, if you cold crash before moving to secondary I think that's where the value really is.

Open to discussion/debate.

[John Sand]

I wonder if the hops may sink into the trub, muting their effect.
And I disagree with the concept that crystal malts don't belong in IPAs, since most IPAs use crystal malt.

[BlackDuck]

Maybe transferring to a secondary before dry hopping might be something to try.

Speaking from experience using gelatin (which is similar/better than a secondary) it makes a big difference.
When I dry-hopped before adding gelatin it was almost completely stripped out after the yeast dropped out.
When I dry-hopped after the gelatin, it was much more prominent.

FWIW, I don't neccesarily equate "secondary" with "yeast removal". The yeast on the BOTTOM of the fermenter isn't affecting the hops at all. It's the yeast in suspension that they bind to and eventually drop out. So, simply transferring to a secondary gets you off the yeast cake but does nothing to drop yeast out of suspension. Now, if you cold crash before moving to secondary I think that's where the value really is.

Open to discussion/debate.

You know your going to make me go all mad scientist on a very near future IPA recipe.

So, if you cold crash before you secondary it, should you cold crash again before bottling????