Saison is ALL ABOUT THE YEAST

[dbrowning]

Belle Saison or 3711 or 3724
Its all about the yeast
And Sorachi Ace
But you really cant beat Belle Saison

[mashani]

Agree, although I do like a hop forward Saison as an alternative to APAs in the summer. As long as you don't try to IPA level it with the flavoring hops, the yeast / saison vibe is still there.

And I do like Belgian Saison yeast too, although it's a PITA to work with. It gives you wonderful bubblegum notes that the French stuff doesn't. But it's a PITA.

As far as I'm concerned 3711 and Bella are interchangeable. So I just use Bella anymore where I would have used 3711.

All that said, you can dry hop a Saison with 4oz of Sorachi and it will still be awesome. Very awesome.

Since Sorachi isn't a traditional hop for Saison, but works nicely as you know, I'll mention that also Nelson Sauvin is also quite excellent in a Saison. Unless you are a hater of it.

[FrozenInTime]

I don't think I will be brewing another Saison. I did up 5 gallons, taste so nasty IMHO I have already dumped one of the 2.5 gallon kegs out. It's too bitter/astringent, just does not go down well. I'll drink the other 2.5 gallon keg because I don't have anything else ready at the moment, but it's going to be going down rough. Glad I have 4 batches brewing in the basement right now.

[mashani]

It should not be like that FIT.

French Saison does ferment out super dry, so you do not need much I the way of bittering hops.

But astringent should not be there regardless. That is not part of the yeast profile.

What recipe did you brew?

[FrozenInTime]

It is a Northern Brewer batch I picked up, a petite Saison. I won't do it again for sure!

[mashani]

I've made that. Unless the goldings they sent you were super potent, it should not have turned out too bitter. It should be only around the mid 20s in IBUs if I remember the recipe correctly. It's just goldings, saaz, and sytrians right? With most of the hops 10 minutes or < I think. Which is plenty for how dry it ferments out, but it still should not be overwhelmingly bitter.

Did you do the AG version or the extract? The only way I can see astringent getting into that is from the grain... I don't know where else you would get that puckering "sucking on a t-bag" vibe, if that's what you mean by astringent. If what you taste is also "grassy" then it's possibly from all the late saaz hops, especially if you left them in the fermenter.

French Saison does leave a slight "tartness" behind, but it's not astringent... just "tart" for lack of a better word. Like citrus tart. Which is why it tastes so good with Sorachi.

Anyways, I'll bring you a good saison if I ever end up in yer parts, so you can see how it should be.