Opinions wanted

[alb]

OK, true confessions:
http://www.williamswarn.com
I’ve had a WilliamsWarn for several years. I was the first in the USA to get one, and the 2nd in North America. (The founder was excited to have a female interested so he let me be first ) It ferments and carbonates in 7-9 days depending on style and yeast flocculation. Its biggest advantages to me are that I can precisely control fermentation temp, I don’t have to lift or move carboys, and it’s a closed system so the beer carbonates naturally as it ferments and is never exposed to air until it flows from the tap. I generally use my own recipes, or occasionally modified WilliamsWarn extract recipes. I didn’t tell anyone here because I read a bunch of (misinformed) negative comments on other blogs. I know the Borg isn’t like that, but I still kept it to myself.

This past fall I bought a Zymatic by Picobrew. I’ve done 4 batches and I like it a lot. My experiences with all-grain last summer made me realize that an AG brew day is exhausting for me. The zymatic is so much easier from a physical standpoint, and I can easily replicate my recipes from brew day to brew day.

Yes, I have a pile of money sunk into my set-up. I feel guilty about it sometimes. But this is my lifetime hobby and these appliances have increased my enjoyment of it. I enjoy watching people smile when they taste my beer. Especially my brudders and my nephew.

I think using my set-up is a good thing. It lets me focus on recipes and experimentation while still allowing me to control the process variables. I love it, and my beers are immeasurably better. It’s keeping me in the game. When I was using the stove and carboys, I never thought that brewers using RIMS or HERMS had an unfair advantage. Advantage? Yes. Unfair? No.

For barbecue, I had no idea there were no standards for judging. It’s pretty tough to shoot at a moving or obscured target. For me, I prefer spicy dry rubs and I find most sauces way too sweet. So I better stick to beer and leave the BBQ comps to others. Like Dave, whose secret sauce is a reputed flavor bomb.

[Kealia]

...this is my lifetime hobby and these appliances have increased my enjoyment of it.

IMO, this is the only part of the post that matters.

There does seem to be a threshold somewhere where some people think that control = cheating and I'm not sure where that is. We all chase things like better temp control, better pitch rates, etc. so if there is a way to control all of that that is available, why wouldn't somebody take advantage of it?

Edit: I just watched the entire video...might warrant another thread to discuss that machine if you're interested Alb.

[mashani]

The WW brewing machine on their web site now looks like an improved upon version of a brewing machine they sold some years ago. I always thought their machine was kind of cool, but no way I could afford it.

But more or less, the way I look at it is as long as you can build your own recipe, using ingredients of your own choosing, you are not cheating. Convenience and control is not cheating.

So where I draw the line is not the picrobrew - I'd buy a picobrew if I had the money... But something more like Zymatics newest "coffee maker" style device, which you can't do anything but drop in a pre-manufactured pod similar to a coffee pod and out comes beer. Even that might not be "cheating" in that they say you will be able to build your own pod on their web site one day. But not being able to use my own ingredients, that's still a deal breaker for me.

[alb]

So where I draw the line is not the picrobrew - I'd buy a picobrew if I had the money... But something more like Zymatics newest "coffee maker" style device, which you can't do anything but drop in a pre-manufactured pod similar to a coffee pod and out comes beer. Even that might not be "cheating" in that they say you will be able to build your own pod on their web site one day. But not being able to use my own ingredients, that's still a deal breaker for me.

Yeah, I’m with you on that. But I wonder if it will end up as a gateway machine, and people will explore more involved brewing methods after trying it.

[bpgreen]

Both the pico brew and WW look really nice. They're too expensive for me, but I'm a cheapskate.

If it's worth it to you, that's what counts. And as you said, you have complete control over the temperature, etc, so you can be assured of consistent results every time.

[Yankeedag]

Here is how I see it Alb...someone once said, if you like the results, you did it right.
If anyone gets their knickers in a knot because you have a spiffier system than them, it's their problem and they can suck Coors.
Brew on, and do it your way.

[FedoraDave]

Like Dave, whose secret sauce is a reputed flavor bomb.

Hey, if you tasted my barbecue sauce, you'd wish it was a beverage.

[JoeBSoBe]

So where I draw the line is not the picrobrew - I'd buy a picobrew if I had the money... But something more like Zymatics newest "coffee maker" style device, which you can't do anything but drop in a pre-manufactured pod similar to a coffee pod and out comes beer. Even that might not be "cheating" in that they say you will be able to build your own pod on their web site one day. But not being able to use my own ingredients, that's still a deal breaker for me.

Yeah, I’m with you on that. But I wonder if it will end up as a gateway machine, and people will explore more involved brewing methods after trying it.

You hit it on the head. I assume the Pico will be my gateway, and keep me from making mistakes while learning. Their kickstarter was too good to pass up, I got everything basically for half price.
Just trying to run as many brews with their unlimited as possible, before I actually have to pay for the packs.