Nano Brewery Startup

[Funky Skunk Brewing]

OK, new 20 gallon brew kettle should be coming in this week along with a big grain order for brewing up 45 gallons over the next two weekends as "samples" to send up to North Carolina and various other locations to get the reactions and feedback from restaurant and bar owners to make the ultimate decision if we will be moving forward with this new direction. If all goes well when the beers are read to head out and enough positive feedback is collected we will be moving forward with this direction as fairly quick pace when that time comes.

I reached out to the local and federal TTB agencies yesterday in order to get a definitive answer on where the brewery can be located, either at my house (not attached to the dwelling as the law states) or does it have to be off site if perhaps I cannot be zoned properly. Right now that is a wait and see from the TTB. Business license and LLC paperwork will most likely be done by at least the first part of April which will just get a little of the paperwork out the way in the beginning. Easy peasy paperwork there as I have done that process before.

Also have a new HLT coming from Mini Brew as the HLT we have will not be big enough for the amount of strike and sparge water we will need with the bigger batches. Getting a great deal on the HLT through our LHBS (pictured below). 15 gallon HLT with a sight glass, all the valves and thermometer all for $125. Gary (owner of the LHBS) is really vetted in wanting us to succeed and we have now turned to ordering almost everything exclusively through him and his shop. Some items are a little more but others are less so it works out in the end and I am keeping it as local as I possibly can.

It's been a few weeks since brewing last and I am ready to fire up the system this Saturday!!

[DaYooper]

Also have a new HLT coming from Mini Brew as the HLT we have will not be big enough for the amount of strike and sparge water we will need with the bigger batches. Getting a great deal on the HLT through our LHBS (pictured below). 15 gallon HLT with a sight glass, all the valves and thermometer all for $125. Gary (owner of the LHBS) is really vetted in wanting us to succeed and we have now turned to ordering almost everything exclusively through him and his shop. Some items are a little more but others are less so it works out in the end and I am keeping it as local as I possibly can.

Wow, that seems to be quite the bargain! Stop making me think about spending money!!!

On another note, regarding distribution in other states, is there anything you need to do to get around the three tier system, etc? You now really have me thinking. We have a "spare" small house that came with a chunk of the hops property, and seeing as I have an ample hops supply, was wondering how to pull something like you are thinking off.

[Funky Skunk Brewing]

On another note, regarding distribution in other states, is there anything you need to do to get around the three tier system, etc? You now really have me thinking. We have a "spare" small house that came with a chunk of the hops property, and seeing as I have an ample hops supply, was wondering how to pull something like you are thinking off.

I know the three tier system exists in Florida but not in North Carolina (where my distribution will take place) so we are currently looking into those laws right now. I am not 100% certain if I can make it in Florida and distribute through a distributor in North Carolina. I wouldn't see why not as other breweries distribute through other states not where the beer is made. Though I am not sure if they have a distributor in the production state that can go to other states, or they have distributors in each of the states their beer is in.

Just beginning this process in this direction and I will be sharing everything I discover for sure on this thread. Nothing, as I'm sure you know, is every clear cut with the TTB/Government. Their FAQ's are some what a joke though have proven at times to be helpful. I just wish they could lay it out a little better/different than just having you search and search and search for forms, laws, regulations, etc. all over their site in no order than I can really tell other than just some random categories. Frustrating at times.

It all may come down to moving to North Carolina if the case warrants us to do so. If the beer is just a raging success and people want it now and Florida will not allow us to do what we want, then we would make the move the North Carolina t that time where they have no three tier system and you can self distribute. All of that in itself contains some HUGE "if's" right now and we'll cross that bridge if and when we come to it. My wife is a hair dresser so she is pretty mobile for her career. Mt real job would be lost as the brewery would then HAVE to be my income source, so you can imagine this is something that is not being thought or talked about lightly at all.

[Funky Skunk Brewing]

New upgrades starting to arrive today. Here are a few shots of the pilot system's new brew kettle -- 20 Gallons. Ready to break this guy in on Saturday

[Chuck N]

New upgrades starting to arrive today. Here are a few shots of the pilot system's new brew kettle -- 20 Gallons. Ready to break this guy in on Saturday

Question:

When you're working up a recipe in your pilot system, is there special considerations you need to take in to account when you scale up to your full sized batches? Or can you just multiply the amount of ingredients by the same number that your batch size increases?

[Funky Skunk Brewing]

Question:

When you're working up a recipe in your pilot system, is there special considerations you need to take in to account when you scale up to your full sized batches? Or can you just multiply the amount of ingredients by the same number that your batch size increases?

For the most part it really is just multiplying up from the pilot system recipe (linear scale), with some exceptions. One being the hop utilization with a bigger water volume, though often not something most beer drinkers would even notice as far as the overall IBU's are concerned in a scaled recipe. You also have to start actively controlling your fermenter temps even more when scaling a recipe up as this will really effect the consistency of the beers, batch over batch from my experiences.

With smaller batches, I know brewers want to control their fermentation temperatures the best they can with their setups, but that is difficult at best to do unless they have some sort of chamber/room where the air temperature as well as the fermentation vessels both have active controllers. Hints why it is important in bigger batches to actively control the fermentation temperatures accurately, over say a five gallon batch where the temps can tend to swing more than I would like in a 25+ gallon batch where a particular temperature is needed/wanted.

Another consideration is the equipment itself. The new system may bring the boil up faster and more intense than the previous system, which could effect the overall end taste of the beer, especially with the caramel malts as an example. So some minor tweaks can arise in that area of the grain bill.

Having said all of this it is mostly a linear scale that I have encountered. Meaning if you used 8 lbs. of 2-row in a 5 gallon batch, you would use 40 lbs. in a 25 gallon batch. A brewing software like Pro Mash or Beer Smith I believe has a scaling module in their software that will help anyone do this without just "winging it". Also, I have even played around with QBrew and just did a linear scale of a 5 gallon batch to a 25 gallon batch and all the mathematical numbers for the IBU, SRM, OG, FG and ABV came out the same as the 5 gallon batch.

The biggest numbers you want to make sure are accurate are your percentages in your grain bill. If you know the percentages and the target IBU's, it's rather easy to scale up or down a recipe to different sizes.

[Funky Skunk Brewing]

Good news from the TTB today. It appears there is no law or regulation that says we cannot have the brewery on our personal property as long as the zoning and building pass their inspections. Really good to have this confirmation direct from the TTB. Here is an exert from the email I received this afternoon:

Please note that there are restrictions on where a brewery can be located. Our regulations, 27 CFR § 25.21 state that:

“A brewery may not be established or operated in any dwelling house (home) or on board any vessel or boat, or in any building or on any premises where the revenue will be jeopardized or the effective administration of this part will be hindered”.

This means that you cannot operate a brewery in your home or basement. We do allow a person to operate a brewery on their residential property if they file a variance from this regulation and the brewery is in a detached building (such as a detached garage), has sufficient security measures in place, and the local authorities have approved this operation in a residential area. See attached example of the variance that must be filed.

[Funky Skunk Brewing]

New HLT arrived yesterday afternoon for the pilot system. 15 gallon from Mini Brew will set up nicely for doing 10 gallon batches. First batch up will be on Saturday with a 10 gallon batch of Hazelnut Brown Ale to send north to North Carolina for more samplings at restaurants and bars through my dad. Looking forward to more feedback from these opportunities in the very near future. These "samplings" will determine if this new direction goes ahead as planned or back to drawing board and a new (revisited) square one.

[ScrewyBrewer]

Eddie are there any restrictions on 'sampling' at local restaurants and bars? If I were to bottle/keg my beer and have a local restaurant serve it to it's customers without charge I was thinking that would be legal in New Jersey. I'm not really sure so I plan to contact someone I know that works for a local beer distributor to see what he says. The whole 'sampling' idea would work if the restaurant owner wasn't breaking or bending any laws by serving beer he didn't buy directly from a distributor.

[Funky Skunk Brewing]

Eddie are there any restrictions on 'sampling' at local restaurants and bars? If I were to bottle/keg my beer and have a local restaurant serve it to it's customers without charge I was thinking that would be legal in New Jersey. I'm not really sure so I plan to contact someone I know that works for a local beer distributor to see what he says. The whole 'sampling' idea would work if the restaurant owner wasn't breaking or bending any laws by serving beer he didn't buy directly from a distributor.

I've seen this go both ways actually....I would check with the local TTB agency to make certain that yourself or the bar/restaurant were not breaking any law as it stands. Or, you breaking anything now that could come back to haunt you moving forward with any type of brew/brew pub later, which I have seen before. I know in Florida they will not allow this type of activity of a non-licensed brewery to hold any type of public tasting/sampling as they equate that to possible transfer of bacteria from a non-taxed/non-licensed entity.

I know here (Florida) you can obtain a "Special Event License" to serve (and profit) from beer sales, from beer you did not produce. The production part becomes the issue to the government as they have no idea where/when/how it was produced, thus giving to their concerns of anything out of their knowledge/control that could occur from the consumption of a product that is not produced in a "legal" brewery. It all comes back to the tax money (of course) and most importantly the health hazards that could come from this type of event, in their eyes.

[DaYooper]

In Michigan I believe the law is still you can not give away alcohol except in a designated tasting room. It really killed us in college as couldnt take advantage of the buy one, get one free on Friday's. Of course, they simply changed it to half price drinks, but for some reason it just wasnt the same.

[DaYooper]

Oh, this finally came through from the wife's phone. We were up in Frankenmuth visiting one of our customers Frankenmuth Brewery the other weekend (okay, we were up there on a cabin fever getaway, wanted beer, and knew if we stopped in to see a customer we could write the miles off), and came across this right next door to the liquor outlet:

FunkySkunk2.jpg (76.94 KiB) Viewed 661 times

Of course, thought of you guys. And no, they are not a brewery but a novelty shop although I just noticed he is holding a stein.

[Funky Skunk Brewing]

HEY!!!! That's awesome!!! Yeah, glad they're not a brewery, but I do see as you said, the stein the skunk is holding. That skunk has a little more colour than ours does. Still, pretty cool thanks for sharing

[Brewbirds]

HEY!!!! That's awesome!!! Yeah, glad they're not a brewery, but I do see as you said, the stein the skunk is holding. That skunk has a little more colour than ours does. Still, pretty cool thanks for sharing

That pic is just WAY to girlie/foofy/icky.

Our Funky Skunk should counter with a Mr. Rufus style mustachio/goatee hair style and be pulling on a tap handle instead; that will show them how to image a product.

[Funky Skunk Brewing]

HEY!!!! That's awesome!!! Yeah, glad they're not a brewery, but I do see as you said, the stein the skunk is holding. That skunk has a little more colour than ours does. Still, pretty cool thanks for sharing

That pic is just WAY to girlie/foofy/icky.

Our Funky Skunk should counter with a Mr. Rufus style mustachio/goatee hair style and be pulling on a tap handle instead; that will show them how to image a product.

Hey ... You could be on to something there