BeerBorg

Pudge wrote:You don't use a spigot anywhere do you? I would run Star San through my bottling bucket but it didn't get into all the nooks and crannies of the spigot and I still picked up an infection.

Didn't think of that! If you have a spigot that comes apart (the good Italian Spigots do) take apart, even if it doesn't come apart boil the snot out of it.

I do use a spigot, but in fact, that's one of the things I have swapped out during my efforts to cure the problem. I usually bottle from an Ale Pail, with the spigot shown below.
But for the two most recent batches, I didn't use that equipment, and instead used one of my LBK's which was known to be "clean" - and still had the issue!

Pudge wrote:You don't use a spigot anywhere do you? I would run Star San through my bottling bucket but it didn't get into all the nooks and crannies of the spigot and I still picked up an infection.

I couldn't agree more, keeping the spigots clean takes a little extra effort, but it's just so well worth it. After every fermentation I tear down the spigot by unscrewing it and looking for cracks and/or shmutz that isn't noticeable from the outside. I've been fermenting beer in the same Ale Pails that I bought over 4 years ago, they do have an interesting odor when they're dried out, but the beers all taste the way they should, from the hoppiest IPAs to the lightest Witbiers.

Pudge wrote:You don't use a spigot anywhere do you? I would run Star San through my bottling bucket but it didn't get into all the nooks and crannies of the spigot and I still picked up an infection.

Another note on spigots is that you need to take them completely apart to get them really clean. I think yankeedag used to post a picture of what he found when he realized they come apart more than just taking the nut off.

Do you still have a LBK anywhere? If so, try brewing a batch in that. If that doesn't get infected, that would point to the better bottle.

I guess I should have checked if there was a second page before posting. Oh, well, I'll leave this here, anyway.

I'd try brewing a batch in the LBK and see if that works. If it does, that makes the better bottle look pretty suspicious.

bpgreen wrote:Do you still have a LBK anywhere? If so, try brewing a batch in that. If that doesn't get infected, that would point to the better bottle.

I guess I should have checked if there was a second page before posting. Oh, well, I'll leave this here, anyway.

I'd try brewing a batch in the LBK and see if that works. If it does, that makes the better bottle look pretty suspicious.

Good idea!

I do always take the bottling spigot fully apart when I clean, BTW. I remember those pics that dag had posted at the old place!

I like the idea of pressing the LBK back into service as a fermenter one time, to confirm or deny the Better Bottle as a possible source.

It does get frustrating, as I've been swapping out and changing things batch after batch, and getting the same result. A few good weeks, and then dump-city. What's extra-frustrating is the fact that most of the beer is really good before the infection kicks in. I had a Cal Common that took honorable mention in the New England Regional this fall, and a pale ale made with home grown hops and all locally-sourced ingredients that scored mid-30s, and an IPA that when young, was one of the best I've made. All of them (and others) turned to crap about 4-5 weeks after bottling.

It's gotten to the point where I now EXPECT to have it happen, and that takes away a lot of the fun. But...I'll keep picking away at it, as I haven't run out of ideas just yet, thanks in no small part to all your helpful suggestions.

Only other thing I can suggest as a stop gap, is if at 3 or 4 or whatever weeks your beer is really good, then put all of it but a few bottles in the fridge. That will shut down pretty much any beer infecting bug. They do not like it cold at all.

Those beers then should stay good. And you can use the few bottles you left out as "testers" later to see if there was an infection or not.

That way you aren't dumping beer.

Good idea, mashani, I like that.
I had gone part-way with that concept on my last batch, the IPA. Knowing that the bugs don't like it cold, I fermented (with US-05) between 60-62, and after bottling, kept the bottles in that same range the whole time. Great beer for a few weeks, then unpleasant, thin, gushers.
But your suggestion is different - storing at 40 may prolong the good and forestall the bad. And leaving a few out as testers is also a great idea.
Thanks!