BeerBorg

RickBeer wrote:The point I was trying to make is that it's highly likely that your 2016 Camaro also contains a defective air bag, and that GM put the same airbag parts into a Camaro a year after you bought your Mustang. Cars are still being produced and repaired today with Takata airbags and Takata is not sure of any fix resolving the problem. It's mostly an issue in humid climates.

As I said, possibly all new cars are crap now.

That is one nice ride!!!!

I think there are two main things different today in vehicles vs. say 20 - 30 years ago.

1) The shakeout in the auto industry doomed lots of suppliers, coupled with the drive to maximize profits shifting more parts production overseas. When there is a smaller choice of parts suppliers, and one has an issue, it ripples. Given the pressure that automakers put on suppliers to cut costs, parts are made less expensively today and may in fact be of lower quality.

2) There are a huge number of computers in these vehicles. That means that the likelihood that a vehicle can last 20 years without a major technology failure is not very good. Most technology failures cannot be fixed by the consumer, and the parts are very expensive. That means we can't keep vehicles like we used to (bought my 2013 F-150 trading in a 1998 Explorer, and we still drive my father in-law's 1999 Mercury Grand Marquis, which just had both the starter and the alternator fail).

I think overall quality vs. 30 years ago is down. We are a disposable society, whether we like it or not.

RickBeer wrote:I think there are two main things different today in vehicles vs. say 20 - 30 years ago.

1) The shakeout in the auto industry doomed lots of suppliers, coupled with the drive to maximize profits shifting more parts production overseas. When there is a smaller choice of parts suppliers, and one has an issue, it ripples. Given the pressure that automakers put on suppliers to cut costs, parts are made less expensively today and may in fact be of lower quality.

2) There are a huge number of computers in these vehicles. That means that the likelihood that a vehicle can last 20 years without a major technology failure is not very good. Most technology failures cannot be fixed by the consumer, and the parts are very expensive. That means we can't keep vehicles like we used to (bought my 2013 F-150 trading in a 1998 Explorer, and we still drive my father in-law's 1999 Mercury Grand Marquis, which just had both the starter and the alternator fail).

I think overall quality vs. 30 years ago is down. We are a disposable society, whether we like it or not.

You and I are on common ground here.

I'll add my own: nice car!

Gymrat wrote: Only 2 things that come to my mind.
1. It's a manual transmission.

I have a cheap ass car with a stick. The stick is what makes it fun to drive, even though it's a cheap ass car. People don't know what they are missing.

Gymrat wrote:

Pudge wrote:Very pretty ride.

It does make you scratch your head a bit why they tried so hard to move that car. I would assume those particular models sell themselves.

Only 2 things that come to my mind.
1. It's a manual transmission. Those have not been selling very well the past several years. Not even in sporty cars. They are no longer even making them an option on a number of cars and even trucks. While I was there doing the deal they told me it would be a little bit before they could get it in to get it cleaned up because they were looking for someone who could drive a stick. And this is at a freaking car dealership!
2. They are trying to reach some kind of quota.

Both good points. They could have been a couple cars away from a big bonus. But, you have to have a manual transmission in something like that, right? Why would you not?

Nice ride, Roger.

Only 2 things that come to my mind.
1. It's a manual transmission. Those have not been selling very well the past several years. Not even in sporty cars. They are no longer even making them an option on a number of cars and even trucks. While I was there doing the deal they told me it would be a little bit before they could get it in to get it cleaned up because they were looking for someone who could drive a stick. And this is at a freaking car dealership!
2. They are trying to reach some kind of quota.[/quote]

Nice ride for sure. I like that much better than previous years. I can't compare the two here in this situation but when I bought my truck new in '13 the optional manual trans was a couple grand more. For as long as I can remember, a manual trans was always a cheaper option.

MadBrewer wrote:Only 2 things that come to my mind.
1. It's a manual transmission. Those have not been selling very well the past several years. Not even in sporty cars. They are no longer even making them an option on a number of cars and even trucks. While I was there doing the deal they told me it would be a little bit before they could get it in to get it cleaned up because they were looking for someone who could drive a stick. And this is at a freaking car dealership!
2. They are trying to reach some kind of quota.

Nice ride for sure. I like that much better than previous years. I can't compare the two here in this situation but when I bought my truck new in '13 the optional manual trans was a couple grand more. For as long as I can remember, a manual trans was always a cheaper option.[/quote]

In a Camaro an Automatic adds about $1600 to the price of the car. Frankly I wouldn't want one. It is the first year for the 8 speed auto. First year for that type of thing is always a gamble. The customer is research and development.

I drove a 14 before I bought my Mustang. It was heavy and sluggish. I didn't like looking at it from the side. It was much "boxier" than the new design. I couldn't get the seat high enough to see over the instrument panel. They corrected all of that with the new 16 design. It is much smaller, lighter, and more responsive than the 10-15s. The 335 HP V6 I got has been used in 4 models of Cadilac for years, so it is a proven engine.