BeerBorg

After cold crashing my Hiphopapocalpse IPA for three days I racked the beer into corny kegs and force carbonated them at 12 psi for a week. For an unfiltered beer with 12 ounces of hops in it I'm pretty satisfied by the color, taste and clarity of the finished beer, I believe it's the best tasting IPA I've brewed to date. Everyone at the barbeque we had last weekend liked it so much I now have a lot of bottled beer they brought over just sitting in my refrigerator. The recipe's pretty simple using 6-row, some Crystal 40 and some CaraPils but the real star of the show is the copious amounts of Chinook hops they just added so much flavor and aroma its fantastic.
I started out with 15 gallons of RO water, for a 10 gallon batch of beer, then added 88% Lactic acid to lower the pH to 5.52 @ 72F. I find it easier to treat all of my brewing water at once and use it for mashing and sparging. I've saved the water profile to use on the next IPA-like beer I brew now that I've tried it in this beer.

102 ppm - Calcium
10 ppm - Magnesium
19 ppm - Sodium
59 ppm - Chloride
208 ppm - Sulfate
0.29 Cloride/Sufate Ratio

Next Thursday night I've been invited to give a presentation to the PALE ALES brew club on my exploits with electric brewing, I'll be bringing along some samples for the gang to try then too. As far as my beers go I rate it right up there with my 420 Special Wheat as a favorite go to beer.

Looks and sounds great to me. I've been working on a huge, hoppy IPA too but have not decided on the hops as I'm using what I have in stock. Don't have much Chinook left but I do love it very much.

I envy your E-system.

MadBrewer wrote:What kind of beers do you usually brew? How do they turn out? Any problems with hazy beer, yeast that doesn't flocculate as it should, low flavor from the beer? Usually most brewers are fighting to lower carbonates, Bicarbonate, Alkalinity to brew lighter beers, as is your water is that of Pilsen where the famous soft Pilsners are known for.

Thanks for the feedback everyone. Especially Mad Props to you MadBrewer. Hoping to slow down long enough to download a calculator this weekend.

I'm all over the board on styles, IPAs, IIPAs, Porters, Stouts, Saisons and now I'll look into Pilsners.
For the most part my beers turn out pretty good, high 30s to mid 40s in competitions. One reason I've started looking at water as I'd like to see if I can squeak out a few more points and keep them all above 40.

That's good to hear, those are some high scores so proof that you got some things down. The thing with brewing water is it seems to have a wide middle range to kind of play around with. That's basically what it will take to get a feel for the impact adjustments make with your water. Some general guidelines are to get at least 50ppm Calcium into the mash for all the benefits it has. A lot of that carries over to the boil, but not always and sometimes it may benefit to add more to the kettle for the boil. Sulfate and Chloride are basically your flavor profile in a sense. Adding Gypsum will bring out the hop character, help Pale Ales IPA's have that dryer finish while Chloride will help to round out malty beers. In dark beers it can really help you taste the individual malts and the different layers of complexity.

PH adjustment is quite easy with Lactic Acid in the mash but you shouldn't have any problems with that because your water is so neutral of Alkalinity and Bicarbonate but it wouldn't hurt to check and monitor it if adjusting with brewing salts. Just play around with EZ Water and record your additions and let the final beer be your guide to what and how you adjust. I would just add not to get hung up on exact numbers or additions, they are just estimates anyway. No need to follow exact profiles down to the "T"...in my opinion anyway.

But pg 216 I think of the Water book by Palmer has a breakdown of how to adjust water for a Pale Ale. It's a profile I wanted to try out, but haven't yet for a balanced but hop forward beer. The profile is said to be not too far off from what Sierra Nevada uses for SNPA. So if it's good enough for them, it makes you think. So if it helps or gives you and Idea the following is that profile...again, for a ballpark figure of course:

Ca: 75ppm
Mg: 13ppm
Na: 35ppm
Chloride: 50ppm
Sulfate: 110ppm
Alkalinity: 25ppm

Look at the ratio of Sulfate to Chloride it is more than double, but the decent amount of chloride and sodium help to keep it balanced and push some of the malt backbone. The alkalinity is low enough to help them attain a mash ph of 5.3 which is what they shoot for. Hope that gives a little idea into how things play together.

Again, many thanks MadBrewer. You are a wealth of water knowledge.
"Exact numbers" is definitely not what I would call my brewing style. Close enough is good enough for me. Most here mention EZ Water, I also see Bru'n Water. From what I've read it says it's best to pick one and stick with it to avoid confusion. Any advantage to one over the other?

Just my .02 that EZ water is a little easier for me. I've used both and sometimes still play with Brun Water and the info they give me is almost identical. I say you can't go wrong with both.

Beer-lord wrote:Just my .02 that EZ water is a little easier for me. I've used both and sometimes still play with Brun Water and the info they give me is almost identical. I say you can't go wrong with both.

+1 I use both as well as find both very accurate and both can bring me .1-.2 within my intended mash ph and they both give me the same numbers when making adjustments. EZ Water is much easier to start out with but Brun' Water has a lot of extra features the does make it helpful and handy. Brun' Water has a list of water profiles that some find helpful to use as a starting point or recommendation...but I haven't used Brun' Water in that way.

I like EZ Water too, but I think I like The Brewers Friend Water Calculator a little better.

Regarding using a water calculator and starting with all distilled water.... Do I set all the water settings at 0, then build with all the additives from there to get to the desired levels?

BlackDuck wrote:Regarding using a water calculator and starting with all distilled water.... Do I set all the water settings at 0, then build with all the additives from there to get to the desired levels?

That's how I get setup in EZ Watercalculator. I enter RO water as 100% of the total water, then input the volume of water to be treated. I have done the same when using distilled water before getting my RO filter installed too. The salt and mineral amount values default then to zero ppm and increase as you add grams of each salt and mineral addition. I'm pretty sure all brewing water calculators would work the same way too.

Thanks...that's what I thought, but since it's new to me, just wanted to make sure.

Paging Mad Brewer....paging Mad Brewer....

Just got a Ward Labs water report...curious to see anyone's comments/thoughts. I've already plugged the numbers into EZWater and have some ideas on treatments. Here's the report:

pH 8.0
Total Dissolved Solids (TDS) Est, ppm 193
Sodium, Na 11
Potassium, K < 1
Calcium, Ca 46
Magnesium, Mg 3
Total Hardness, CaCO3 128
Nitrate, NO3-N 3.0 (SAFE)
Sulfate, SO4-S 4
Chloride, Cl 19
Carbonate, CO3 < 1.0
Bicarbonate, HCO3 137
Total Alkalinity, CaCO3 113

At just a quick glance, that looks like some pretty decent water. You may not need to do a whole bunch to that. Of course, it will depend on what type of beer you are making too.

BlackDuck wrote:At just a quick glance, that looks like some pretty decent water. You may not need to do a whole bunch to that. Of course, it will depend on what type of beer you are making too.

+1.

That is very similar to my brewing water. First thing is your So4 is actually higher. You need to multiply So4-S which Ward uses by 3 to get so4 that you will use in any water calculator. No biggie at all just means your sulfate level is higher than your chloride level. Just like my brewing water.

As mentioned you dont need to play around a lot with that water. You could make some great beers as is. Your biggest hurdle will be the high alkalinity. It will keep your mash ph high and ruin beers and make it hard to brew light styles like lagers and Blonde ales...etc. But the alkalinity isnt so high that it cant be controlled. Lactic acid in the mash and sparge water to nuetrize that alkalinity will do wonders for your beer. Making cleaner, smoother, clearer and better tasting beer. For middle of the road beers Pale Ale, Amber Ales you should be fine. For dark beers like Porters and Stouts some Chloride will help balance out the beer and richen the flavors and complexity. For lighter styles you will need to focus on acidification for proper ph throughout the process. It doesnt take much but some small adjustments can make a huge impact for the better.

Wow, that was quick! Thanks, BD and MB - I greatly appreciate your input.

And, I concur - it looks to me like my water is relatively "brew-ready" out of the tap, with the exception of the pH being on the high side. As-is, the numbers in EZWater and Palmer's spreadsheet seem to indicate a profile that leans malty.
Some lactic acid to keep the pH in check, a small amount epsom salts (and a little more for bitter-forward recipes), and possibly some fine-tuning w/ gypsum and cal chloride, and I'm good to go.

I'm glad I fot my water analyzed. I've been using gallon bottles of distilled water from the supermarket and building from scratch. Sending in the sample cost me ~ $25 (Household Water test plus 1st class postage), but after a few batches I'll get that back by not spending $1/gallon on distilled jugs. Not to mention the aggravation of making the trip, lugging the bottles, disposing of the empties, etc.

To Duck and Mad, again: