BeerBorg

I'm doing a Hop Head Double IPA from Midwest http://www.midwestsupplies.com/hop-head ... a-kit.html It's in a secondary Better Bottle now, it calls for 2 0z of Cascade leaf dry hopped the last 7-10 days. I've done this one before and put the hops in a weighted bag, it was hard to get it into the carboy and even with all the weight it still didn't go to the bottom, and to top it off I broke the carboy trying to get the bag out while cleaning ( a story you all heard). My question is if I go commando with that much leaf hops what will happen? Will they just float on top and not get absorbed and not do much? I can go with the weighted hop sack again but that really was a pain to do also. What do you think would be the best way to go?

I've never dry hopped with leaf hops, but with pellet, I just drop them in commando. After time, the pellets sink to the bottom. I feel like it should be the same with leaf, but I can't say for sure.

Maybe split them between to hop sacks, tie them good with unwaxed/unflavored dental floss, hang the ends out of the opening and slide the bung over them. That way, u can just pull the sacks out easy peasy? Throw in a sanitized marble in each sac so they sink some?

I made that same brew about 18 months ago and enjoyed it very much. That time I used leaf hops and didn't weigh them down. 6 months later I made it again but used pellet hops for the dry hops and I didn't like it as much (though my taste buds were probably starting to get ruined).
I've not used leaf hops commando in a long time but even if they float, they're still releasing their goodness so there's no worry about going commando.

philm00x wrote:I've never dry hopped with leaf hops, but with pellet, I just drop them in commando. After time, the pellets sink to the bottom. I feel like it should be the same with leaf, but I can't say for sure.

I've comamando'd pellet hops a lot of times, but the leaf hops are, I guess you could say fluffy like dried leaves. Pellet hops will eventually sink to the bottom, but I don't know if these will. Putting 2 oz in a sack is a big sack. What FIT said using 2 bags might be better, IDK. Last time I did this recipy I stuffed the hop sack down into the carboy, it looked like a big weiner, I had 6 stainless steel 1/2" nuts in the bag for weight and it still floated on top , then the bag was so swelled up I couldn't get it out of the neck of the carboy when done and cleaning... Here's what I'm thinking of doing, commando the leaf hops and I'll pick up another oz. of pellet cascades and add them too. I'm not to worried of over dry hopping this anyways, it did lack a little in my opinion for a real good IPA. but this is a good brew and I highly recommend it for IPA lovers.

Something else I forgot to mention, I'll be racking this into my bottling bucket when it is time to bottle, so I shouldn't get a lot of trash, this type of brew would be hard to do in a LBK or a bucket with a spigot.

my main complaint about dry hopping with leaf hops is that they adsorb soooooooooooo......... much beer

haerbob3 wrote:my main complaint about dry hopping with leaf hops is that they adsorb soooooooooooo......... much beer

Yes I agree and you are right, less beer to bottle and drink..........

I always wondered what are the benefits to using leaf hops vs using pellet hops in any recipe.

BeerRust wrote:I always wondered what are the benefits to using leaf hops vs using pellet hops in any recipe.

I'm sure someone with more knowledge than me will chime in here but I think they get treated kind of like produce in that the leaf hops are "fresher" because they get packaged sooner since they don't go through the extra steps of processing that the pellets do.

The whole leaf hops will float on top, they will work and your beer will absorb the oils and aromas. Just saying, I never use pellets, whole leaf hops only for all the additions.

Rebel_B wrote:The whole leaf hops will float on top, they will work and your beer will absorb the oils and aromas. Just saying, I never use pellets, whole leaf hops only for all the additions.

Yup, the big thing is that they dont go through the heat of the hammer mill when they are being pelletized. If you are speaking of fresh (not dried) hops they also do not go through the dehydration process which can drive off some aroma.

Most brewers who brew with fresh do simply as a way to welcome in the harvest with a special beer. It is a very long brew day for them with having to pick up the hops and start brewing as soon as they return. It is also not a repeatable beer as there is no good way of knowing the IBUs from fresh as by the time the results would be in the beer would already be brewed.

From those I have talked to, there is no realy benefit to using dried leaf vs pellets assuming the production process is well controlled. But, I can see one of the benefits of fresh over dried would be a lot less moisture absorption with the fresh still having the majority of their moisture content.

BeerRust wrote:I always wondered what are the benefits to using leaf hops vs using pellet hops in any recipe.

I'm not certain if theses would be benefits or advantages but this is some I have found dry hopping with both whole leaf hops and hop pellets. These are all my opinion and experiences and not 100% solid facts, so take it as you will.

- The only way whole leaf hops will give off more flavor and aroma depends on their freshness against pellet hops
- Fresher at times (obviously) than pellet hops and easily identified by rubbing the hops between your palms and sniffing their aroma
- At times, not all of the whole leaf hops will be touching the beer unless you carefully swirl the wort around to get them into it. Or use some sort of weighted sack
- Pellet hops (to me) give a better aroma than whole leaf hops, where as whole leaf hops offer a better flavor than pellet hops

One thing to remember/consider when dry hopping is the timing and temperature at which you do it at. You don't want it to be during any of the active fermentation process, as the produced Co2 in the fermentation process will hurt the aroma of the hops. To me, the best results of dry hopping (Ales) comes at temperatures around 65F and not too far off that number.

The ingredient in a hop that adds those aromas at dry hopping is Mycerne, which is an aromatic hydrocarbon. It does not produce its higher levels of PPB's (parts per billion) in a boil atmosphere as it breaks down rather easily, losing it's aromatic properties, but rather much more when it is used in dry hopping scenarios. Certain hops are higher in Mycerene percentages and those tend to be the ones that are dry hooped in a lot of say, IPA's. Cascade, Simcoe and Amarillo all have at least 60% total hop oil of Mycerene.

Pellet hops can have as much as 15% more of the Mycerene extracted during a dry hop even though a whole leaf hop can have somewhere in the range of 50-60% more Mycerene in them in certain varieties. So to me, the best bet is going with pellet hops for dry hopping if you are looking for the aroma of that hop more over the flavor.

I don't believe many (if any) could tell if a beer was dry hopped with whole leaf or pellet hops just on flavor and/or aroma.

I've been going commando. Today I decided to try the marble idea. When I was cleaning up, I emptied the hop sacks and discovered that the one that had the big marble in it is now full of marble pieces... While they are large, and it's highly unlikely that any glass left the hop sac and went into the beer, I'm likely to toss the entire batch - waiting to discuss with SWMBO later. $33 and 4+ hours down the drain, plus another trip to the LHBS to buy all new ingredients. I'm back to commando.

RickBeer wrote: When I was cleaning up, I emptied the hop sacks and discovered that the one that had the big marble in it is now full of marble pieces...

Rick, what you think happened to make it break apart like that? I used stainless steel nuts in a hop sack full of leaf hops as I said before and it didn't sink, do you think it hit the bottom hard and broke? I have the brew on my OP/OT going now on day 8 after commando leaf hops and they are absorbing but still on top, going to bottle this coming weekend and see what happens.