Because my wife does like hefs and witbiers, I grabbed a bottle of this in my recent mixer-sixer for us to try.
Knowing that it was Stone I expected a hoppy version of a wit going in. Reading the label they do mention the use of Mandarina Bavaria hops which I really like so I was excited to give it a try.
The aroma is orange, corriander, maybe some of the MB hops coming through + fresh bread.
The upfront taste was really good but it left a really dry, astringent taste and feel on the tongue that neither of us cared for. It built as you kept drinking and prevented me from really liking the beer. It's similar to that taste/feel you get if you get some pith while eating an orange which I find unpleasant.
It may be more up the alley of saison drinkers with that finish, but if others try it I'd be curious to hear their thoughts. It was a fresh bottle so I have no reason to believe there was anything wrong with it - it just didn't finish well for me.
Stone Citrusy Wit
Moderators: BlackDuck, Beer-lord, LouieMacGoo, philm00x, gwcr
Re: Stone Citrusy Wit
So OK, I finally found a bottle of this, so this is what I think.
It smells awesome.
Then comes the drinking part. I do actually kind of like it. But I don't want to drink more right now. And I would not call it a WIT. And I'd do stuff a bit different if I was to try to make something like this myself. So I will try to explain why below.
So it's not wheaty enough seeming and too bitter and dry to be a true WIT. By that I mean that it's more dry bready/biscuit like then typical wit beer "wheaty", IE where in a true WIT the unmalted wheat adds a slight sweetness that complements the orange and corriander. It's actually pretty clear, not WIT like translucent. It has 10-15 more IBUs then it needs if it wants to be an actual WIT beer. But that sounds about right for a Stone beer. If anyone has had a Great Lakes Dortmunder, the bready/biscuit vibe in this is almost as strong as that beer. I don't know what the grain bill was in this but it seems that it needs a lot more unmalted wheat and/or oats and/or less filtering to be more like a true WIT. Once this warms up it's as clear as a KristalWeisen.
The thing about kaffir lime leaves is they can taste soapy if you use too much. The thing about coriander is the same. I don't think they used too much of either as an individual ingredient, but the mix together is enough that I am getting a good bit of a soapy/perfume like vibe that I'm finding distracting. It's not so strong that I don't want to drink the rest of this, but it's strong enough that I don't want another one right now.
There is a bitterness and astringency that sticks around between sips, unless you eat a bite of something between then. The soapy/perfume like vibe sticks around too. I sat here for 5 minutes and it never went away until I ate a pretzel. I think that's caused by the mix of the kaffir and extra tangerine piled on top of the normal WIT things (I am going to assume they used tangerine zest, as it is much more zesty and pithy then juicy) along with the too potent bittering addition. It just has too much bitter stuff in it for how pithy and dry seeming it is if you want to call it a WIT. It may not really be drier as far as OG/FG but the missing wheaty sweetness is making it seem that way.
I think that's where they saison comparison Kealia had comes from. Although it actually isn't as dry as a saison. It would be totally wacked if it had dried out that much. But the perceived bitterness is still as much as an APA, or a bitter dry saison.
I don't mind the hop flavors, they are mellow and they compliment the citrusy stuff. Although I'm actually wishing there was more Amarillo added late, and that they would have ditched the magnum (bittering addition) completely. They are supposed to be radicals, maybe they should have tried being more radical by forgoing the bittering addition if they aren't going to let the wheat really stand out. That would have added a *juicy* vibe that this is missing that might mellow out the pith, and it would tone down the bitterness. Maybe that would push it more into APA territory, but I think since it's already not a true WIT I'd like it better that way.
Even though that all sounds like bitching, I don't dislike this beer. These are all just things I would tweak if I was doing it myself.
I think the way this stands, if I was eating a meal that was spicy (Thai/Indian food especially) or some oily fish, this would be nice to wash it down between bites.
But just as a beer to sip on as a beer on its own, I don't think I want a lot of it all in one sitting. I'd not "session" this beer. I'd drink one then switch to something else.
EDIT: Note that it does seem to blend together better and seem a bit less bitter/astringent as it warms up a bit, but it still has that perfume/soapy thing going on even when warm.
It smells awesome.
Then comes the drinking part. I do actually kind of like it. But I don't want to drink more right now. And I would not call it a WIT. And I'd do stuff a bit different if I was to try to make something like this myself. So I will try to explain why below.
So it's not wheaty enough seeming and too bitter and dry to be a true WIT. By that I mean that it's more dry bready/biscuit like then typical wit beer "wheaty", IE where in a true WIT the unmalted wheat adds a slight sweetness that complements the orange and corriander. It's actually pretty clear, not WIT like translucent. It has 10-15 more IBUs then it needs if it wants to be an actual WIT beer. But that sounds about right for a Stone beer. If anyone has had a Great Lakes Dortmunder, the bready/biscuit vibe in this is almost as strong as that beer. I don't know what the grain bill was in this but it seems that it needs a lot more unmalted wheat and/or oats and/or less filtering to be more like a true WIT. Once this warms up it's as clear as a KristalWeisen.
The thing about kaffir lime leaves is they can taste soapy if you use too much. The thing about coriander is the same. I don't think they used too much of either as an individual ingredient, but the mix together is enough that I am getting a good bit of a soapy/perfume like vibe that I'm finding distracting. It's not so strong that I don't want to drink the rest of this, but it's strong enough that I don't want another one right now.
There is a bitterness and astringency that sticks around between sips, unless you eat a bite of something between then. The soapy/perfume like vibe sticks around too. I sat here for 5 minutes and it never went away until I ate a pretzel. I think that's caused by the mix of the kaffir and extra tangerine piled on top of the normal WIT things (I am going to assume they used tangerine zest, as it is much more zesty and pithy then juicy) along with the too potent bittering addition. It just has too much bitter stuff in it for how pithy and dry seeming it is if you want to call it a WIT. It may not really be drier as far as OG/FG but the missing wheaty sweetness is making it seem that way.
I think that's where they saison comparison Kealia had comes from. Although it actually isn't as dry as a saison. It would be totally wacked if it had dried out that much. But the perceived bitterness is still as much as an APA, or a bitter dry saison.
I don't mind the hop flavors, they are mellow and they compliment the citrusy stuff. Although I'm actually wishing there was more Amarillo added late, and that they would have ditched the magnum (bittering addition) completely. They are supposed to be radicals, maybe they should have tried being more radical by forgoing the bittering addition if they aren't going to let the wheat really stand out. That would have added a *juicy* vibe that this is missing that might mellow out the pith, and it would tone down the bitterness. Maybe that would push it more into APA territory, but I think since it's already not a true WIT I'd like it better that way.
Even though that all sounds like bitching, I don't dislike this beer. These are all just things I would tweak if I was doing it myself.
I think the way this stands, if I was eating a meal that was spicy (Thai/Indian food especially) or some oily fish, this would be nice to wash it down between bites.
But just as a beer to sip on as a beer on its own, I don't think I want a lot of it all in one sitting. I'd not "session" this beer. I'd drink one then switch to something else.
EDIT: Note that it does seem to blend together better and seem a bit less bitter/astringent as it warms up a bit, but it still has that perfume/soapy thing going on even when warm.