I Want To Master This...

[UltramanNick]

I've gone from an occasional brewer to one that has two LBKs fermenting and a batch lagering in the fridge. However, I still feel as if I'm doing this as a "hit and miss" operation and I really want to be able to master brewing (with the MB kit). I know there are other ways to brew but this is the best I can do considering my limitation to space and what The Wife will tolerate.

I've got one batch in a LBK that is scheduled to be bottled on 1/4 but I did a hydrometer test and it's no-where near ready--even though I'm over a week out. The beer tasted very yeasty and a little sour and there's plenty of trub at the bottom. But the brew is very cloudy. The second batch, scheduled for bottling on 1/14 has trub and is much clearer that the first.

What I really do not want is low carbonated or "unfinished" beer with a sour aftertaste. That's been the trouble in the last few batches which really is discouraging me. I may have to give them more time to ferment or lager....or both! I want to get to the point where I brew the batch, take a zero reading, let it ferment, bottle, and the lager to successful, great tasting beer for me and my neighbors to enjoy. I don't want to apologize for it any more!

[mashani]

By sour do you mean "green apple" or "apple cider" like flavors, or vinegar like sour?

When you mean "lagering in the fridge" - you did not just put sugar in the bottles and put it in the fridge did you? If so, DON'T DO THAT. If you do that you will get nothing but flat cidery beer. Instead put sugar in them, put them somewhere warmer (65+) and dark (or in a box) and *ignore them for 3 weeks at least*, then put one in the fridge if you want and see how it is.

[RickBeer]

Nick,

I strongly suggest you go back and read the responses to your questions on the Mr. Beer forum. I provided you with an excellent video on how to read a hydrometer, along with an explanation about what you should expect for a final gravity reading based on your original gravity reading (approximately 25%). Here's that post. You never will get a "zero reading". And once you get the proper FG reading (ideally two matching readings 48 hours apart), you're done fermenting, it's time to bottle.

As far being ready to bottle, 21 days after starting is the right time, and you seem close to those based on your prior posts. And as Mashani noted, you should be keeping the bottles at room temp, not in the frig. There is no "lagering" with Mr. Beer - the bottles carbonate and condition - ideally for 4 weeks at least - at room temp.

[John Sand]

Welcome back Nick. The two brewers replying above have vastly more experience than I. But I was right where you are when I started, my first few batches were not good. I struggled through it, and now my beers are good. But I still have doubts, questions, and flaws. You will improve, study and practice. I, and others have found that brewing MrBeer straight up can result in mediocre beer. You might try stepping up to steeping grains with it.

[Ibasterd]

I really want to be able to master brewing (with the MB kit). I know there are other ways to brew but this is the best I can do considering my limitation to space and what The Wife will tolerate.

I am with you on that. I feel like I am ready to try some partial mash or even all grain, but I have space and "wife tolerance" limitations. Be patient and read a lot on this forum. You will figure it out.

[UltramanNick]

Thanks for your responses and allow me to clarify:

-- The bottles that are in the fridge were left out in room temperature for at least 2 weeks before going into the fridge. They "should" be ready by 1/1/14 but I intend to keep them in there for at least a week longer.

-- I did watch the hydrometer video; the first reading I took on the batch that is currently in the LBK #1 was 1.028 because I overfilled the keg. The reading I took was no where near the 1.004 reading it needs to be to start bottling. However, the batch on LBK #2 was spot on at 1.040 before I pitched the yeast.

-- The sour taste is "cidery"....is that good or bad?

Am I a sloppy brewer? One thing I DO need is a long glass test tube with a base for the hydrometer. The plastic tube that came with it is not working for me.

[mashani]

If "cidery" the general rule of thumb answer is to leave it at room temperature longer. Either in the fermenter, bottles or both. Don't put it in the fridge so soon. Wait another week or two. At room temperature the yeast will "eat" (uptake) the acetaldehyde (the green apple / cidery fermentation by product), once they run out of other stuff to eat.

If your using the Mr. Beer yeast, what temps are you fermenting at? My experience with the "new" Mr. Beer/Coopers yeast (not the BrewDemon yeast or "old" Mr. Beer yeast which is S-33) is that if you ferment under about 65 degrees it throws off *a lot* more acetaldehyde then if you ferment warmer and then takes a lot longer to condition. It's a yeast that does well 65-70. If you were to use say S-05 or S-04 or Nottingham, then the lower temps are great. I save the "new" Mr. Beer/Coopers yeast packs for when my temps are warmer.

[FedoraDave]

Thanks for your responses and allow me to clarify:

-- The bottles that are in the fridge were left out in room temperature for at least 2 weeks before going into the fridge. They "should" be ready by 1/1/14 but I intend to keep them in there for at least a week longer.

Warm-condition your beer for as long as you can before chilling it. It really does make a difference. Two weeks at room temperature will allow for adequate carbonation, but there are subtle changes that occur the longer the beer sits and things are allowed to mellow. Extended time in the fridge doesn't do anything for ales. They're not going to get any colder after a couple of days, and they're not going to condition anymore.

Am I a sloppy brewer? One thing I DO need is a long glass test tube with a base for the hydrometer. The plastic tube that came with it is not working for me.

I don't know if you're a sloppy brewer or not, but I do believe you're an inexperienced brewer, and maybe a somewhat ignorant one, too. Neither of these are bad, nor are they permanent conditions. Brew more, and you'll gain experience and learn by doing. The most graceful athletes and dancers fell on their kiesters a lot when they were learning how to walk. That's just how it is when you're first learning a skill.

Ignorance can also be overcome by reading and asking questions. You can't be expected to know a lot of stuff about a topic that is new to you. In fact, there are things you don't even know that you don't know. But someone is likely to know, and can impart that knowledge to you. So read stuff and ask questions. That's what The Borg is for, and why people like Palmer and Papazian et al. wrote (and continue to write) their books and blogs. Eventually you'll get to the point where you're able to answer noobie questions, and you'll be amazed at how much knowledge you've acquired.

If you continue brewing and learning, I predict that a year from now, you'll look back at this time and realize you were just going through a stage that nearly all of us went through when we were beginning.

I also think that the kits such as Mr. Beer and BrewDemon, while a good starting point for new brewers, do leave something to be desired as stand-alone recipes. Supplementing them with specialty grains, hops, and even additional extracts can enhance them and allow you to customize your beer a little more. If this much involvement puts your domestic bliss at risk, then you'll have to reach some sort of compromise, but that's for you to determine.

The best advice I can give you at this point is keep at it, continue learning, and RDWHAHB.

[RickBeer]

Thanks for your responses and allow me to clarify:

-- The bottles that are in the fridge were left out in room temperature for at least 2 weeks before going into the fridge. They "should" be ready by 1/1/14 but I intend to keep them in there for at least a week longer.

No they won't be. Remove them from the refrigerator, warm them to room temp, and let them sit for at least two more weeks. There is no such thing as "lagering" beer ales in the refrigerator. You need 4 weeks at room temp.

-- I did watch the hydrometer video; the first reading I took on the batch that is currently in the LBK #1 was 1.028 because I overfilled the keg. The reading I took was no where near the 1.004 reading it needs to be to start bottling. However, the batch on LBK #2 was spot on at 1.040 before I pitched the yeast.

If you got a reading of 1.028 for OG, then FG should be somewhere around 1.007, not 1.004. If you got two readings the same in 48 hours, and it was anywhere near there, it was done. There is no reading that all beer will be at. Every batch is different.

-- The sour taste is "cidery"....is that good or bad?

This is due to you not carbonating and conditioning the beer for four weeks at room temp. At 2 weeks in the bottle, the beer is green and WILL taste cidery.

Am I a sloppy brewer? One thing I DO need is a long glass test tube with a base for the hydrometer. The plastic tube that came with it is not working for me.

The tube that hydrometers come in are NOT sampling tubes. You MUST have something that allows the hydrometer to float and be read. You need a PLASTIC hydrometer sample tube.

Brewing is about learning and following directions. 3-4 is the default rule we all follow. 3 weeks in the keg at room temp, 4 weeks in the bottle at room temp. If you put your bottles in the frig at 2 weeks, is that sloppy? No, it's just going to give you crappy, applely tasting beer EVERY time.

I started brewing about 18 months ago. My first batches tasted like lousy. Some were done at too high temps, i.e. it was 73 before it started fermenting. Others were tasted after not enough time in the bottle. Nearly 30 batches later, my beers taste great. The other night my family polished off 8 different kinds and nearly a case total, and every one of them was great.

While you can always "make beer" even if you don't do common practices, you get the result you'd expect. Have patience.

[UltramanNick]

Wow, didn't consider myself as as "ignorant brewer." That's pretty strong stuff. Well, I will resolve to working to perfect my craft and just lurking on the boards instead of wasting bandwidth with my ignorant questions.

[FedoraDave]

ig·no·rant adjective \ˈig-n(ə-)rənt\
: lacking knowledge or information

Being ignorant isn't a bad thing, and I didn't use the word as a pejorative; merely as a descriptive. If you didn't have a certain level of ignorance, you wouldn't be asking the questions you ask, which shows you wish to get rid of your ignorance, and that's a good thing. We are all ignorant about certain things; it's part of the human condition.

Only if you were willfully ignorant or stubbornly ignorant would the description be intended to carry a rebuke.

No need to get all butthurt.

[Ibasterd]

Things are starting to turn bad on this thread. Everyone relax. Ultramannick, I think what you need to realize is that brewing beer requires a bit more patience than we were led to believe by the Mr. Beer instructions. I was initially dissapointed with my first batch because I followed the 2-2-2 rule. It came our cidery and undercarbonated because I did not let the beer "warm" condition in the bottles long enough. I now let my beer ferment approx. 3 weeks in the LBK and warm condition four weeks in the bottle before putting in the fridge, and then I only put what I plan on drinking in the fridge, and let the rest warm condition longer. I am on my 7th batch and have never taken a hydrometer reading. If you wait the 3 weeks in the LBK, you should be safe and fermentation will be complete.

Try not to get discouraged. Get a handle on the procedure and BE PATIENT. RDWHAHB- Relax, don't worry (have a homebrew when it's ready)!

[Bluejaye]

Wow, didn't consider myself as as "ignorant brewer." That's pretty strong stuff. Well, I will resolve to working to perfect my craft and just lurking on the boards instead of wasting bandwidth with my ignorant questions.

I think you might want to take the time to look up and understand what ignorant means. The hat used the correct word, in the correct context. It's not an insult.

I am quite ignorant of quantum mechanics and the finer details of nuclear fusion. It doesn't mean I'm stupid.

[Brewbirds]

Ultramannick, I think what you need to realize is that brewing beer requires a bit more patience than we were led to believe by the Mr. Beer instructions. I was initially dissapointed with my first batch because I followed the 2-2-2 rule. It came our cidery and undercarbonated because I did not let the beer "warm" condition in the bottles long enough. I now let my beer ferment approx. 3 weeks in the LBK and warm condition four weeks in the bottle before putting in the fridge, and then I only put what I plan on drinking in the fridge, and let the rest warm condition longer. I am on my 7th batch and have never taken a hydrometer reading. If you wait the 3 weeks in the LBK, you should be safe and fermentation will be complete.

Try not to get discouraged. Get a handle on the procedure and BE PATIENT.

What he said !!!!!

First: the instructions on some beer kits can be misleading and any that say you will have drinkable beer in a short period of time or flat out wrong.

Second: to brew your own beer at home requires patience and perseverance. You cannot get frustrated early in your brewing attempts. You have to accept that the brewing process from beginning to end takes time and you must be willing allow the proper amount of time to pass for each stage in the process.

Third: you want to "master" your brewing; after what I've said above the next step is to establish your brewing methods. You need to solidify a system you will use going forward that addresses each step in your brew day so that your are organized and prepared. Do you have dedicated brew gear together? How will you utilize the space you brew in? Do you need a checklist for measuring out/preparing ingredients? Do you have impeccable sanitation practices in place? Are you taking quality notes before, during and after your brew session?

Fourth: do you under stand the basic concepts of how beer is made. As a beginning brewer you may still be at the "open can - dump in water" stage that some kits present as beer making but you will need to make a slot somewhere in your life schedule to learn at least a little bit about the when, where,what, why, and how of what is happening that turns ingredients into beer. Obviously the door is wide open after that to how much info you have the time or interest to absorb on the subject.

Fifth: EVERY SINGLE PERSON ON THIS FORUM WAS A BEGINNING BREWER ONCE. And they have stayed here to help others of their own free will because they love home brewing and hope to others through all of the issues they have experienced in the past.

Fact - you will make some bad batches even after you've been brewing for 3,5,10 or 20 years, that is not because of what you don't know about brewing it is because brewers are not GOD. You can't make beer without yeast, yeast is a life form and in life stuff happens!

[haerbob3]

Fifth: EVERY SINGLE PERSON ON THIS FORUM WAS A BEGINNING BREWER ONCE. And they have stayed here to help others of their own free will because they love home brewing and hope to others through all of the issues they have experienced in the past.

I have been brewing for a long time and I consider myself a beginner!!! As home-brewers we must remember that our beer is alive till we drink it.